The Alex Garland film is sparking discussion about its release during a contentious election year: "The idea of civil war actually keeps me up at night."
President Lincoln offered Robert E. Lee control of the Union Army. The Confederate officer corps was pretty high quality; Custer ended up a General on the Union side. The CSA had good relations with the two superpowers of the day [UK and France] and a highly sought after product [cotton]. Most of their troops were hard scrabble country boys who were used to working from sun up to sun set on a plate of beans.
The Anti-Federalist forces of today are lead by Donald Trump and Lauren Bobert.
The CSA did not have good relations with any super powers. They had to meet in secret and were never acknowledged. The only part of any super power relationship that actually benefited the CSA was buying cotten smuggled out on the black market and allowing the sale of old warships and they never actually arrived. Also the idea that southern soldiers were better is an idea backed up by the lost cause for decades now, and doesn’t seem to be universally true.
It wasn’t that the south had better officers, Lee was just the best on the continent.
And he was against the civil war, but back then America was more like the UN. So when Lee’s state seceded, he saw no other option than joining the Souths military.
Dude was one of the loudest people on both sides against the war, before during and after it.
The details matter because it’s a great lesson on how dangerous blind loyalty/patriotism is.
Lee was irreplaceable. If he had just stayed out of the war, it would have been over much faster with less deaths
True enough in certain statements he made, but while admittedly he was no Alexander Stephens, he sure as shit got stuck in.
but back then America was more like the UN.
Not really. Regional identities were much stronger and enforcement mechanisms weaker, and no income tax meant the funds available to the Federal government were limited so it wasn’t particularly flush with cash to throw its weight around, but the country had already withstood several constitutional crises that placed it as a polity WAY more integrated even than the modern EU, to say nothing of the UN. The degree to which secession was viewed as an inevitability and/or no big deal for the times is way overblown by people with a vested interest in Reconstruction going smoothly for the existing power structures, and then the lost cause types who inherited their narratives. Don’t fall into their traps.
So when Lee’s state seceded, he saw no other option than joining the Souths military.
To be clear, this was also very much because he was a dedicated slaveowner, and not one known for treating enslaved people on his properties well, or for having any empathy with freedmen after. He had that certain old Virginia ambivalence about the institution itself, but he was absolutely convinced that whites owning blacks was “necessary” and by god he was good at doing what was “necessary.”
Militarily, Lee was a skilled tactician (by contemporary US standards… European observers familiar with Crimea were aghast at the life-wasting Napoleonic nonsense they saw from both sides), but he had strategic blind spots that had him ultimately fighting a war the South was poorly suited for. Now, sure, he probably was the best General available at the start of the war, but not by so wide a margin as people like to claim, and personal lionization of Lee is another Lost Cause ratfuck.
President Lincoln offered Robert E. Lee control of the Union Army. The Confederate officer corps was pretty high quality; Custer ended up a General on the Union side. The CSA had good relations with the two superpowers of the day [UK and France] and a highly sought after product [cotton]. Most of their troops were hard scrabble country boys who were used to working from sun up to sun set on a plate of beans.
The Anti-Federalist forces of today are lead by Donald Trump and Lauren Bobert.
Really good Robert E. Lee 4 parter on Behind the Bastards a few weeks ago. Highly recommended.
The CSA did not have good relations with any super powers. They had to meet in secret and were never acknowledged. The only part of any super power relationship that actually benefited the CSA was buying cotten smuggled out on the black market and allowing the sale of old warships and they never actually arrived. Also the idea that southern soldiers were better is an idea backed up by the lost cause for decades now, and doesn’t seem to be universally true.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/06/books/review/lion-and-the-fox-alexander-rose.html
Sounds like you’d like this one.
“The Lion And The Fox” by Alexander Rose. True story of the Union and Confederates in England, trying to control the seas.
Ooh, I probably would, thanks for the recommendation! This was a single chapter in a book I read that covered the whole history of the war.
It wasn’t that the south had better officers, Lee was just the best on the continent.
And he was against the civil war, but back then America was more like the UN. So when Lee’s state seceded, he saw no other option than joining the Souths military.
Dude was one of the loudest people on both sides against the war, before during and after it.
The details matter because it’s a great lesson on how dangerous blind loyalty/patriotism is.
Lee was irreplaceable. If he had just stayed out of the war, it would have been over much faster with less deaths
True enough in certain statements he made, but while admittedly he was no Alexander Stephens, he sure as shit got stuck in.
Not really. Regional identities were much stronger and enforcement mechanisms weaker, and no income tax meant the funds available to the Federal government were limited so it wasn’t particularly flush with cash to throw its weight around, but the country had already withstood several constitutional crises that placed it as a polity WAY more integrated even than the modern EU, to say nothing of the UN. The degree to which secession was viewed as an inevitability and/or no big deal for the times is way overblown by people with a vested interest in Reconstruction going smoothly for the existing power structures, and then the lost cause types who inherited their narratives. Don’t fall into their traps.
To be clear, this was also very much because he was a dedicated slaveowner, and not one known for treating enslaved people on his properties well, or for having any empathy with freedmen after. He had that certain old Virginia ambivalence about the institution itself, but he was absolutely convinced that whites owning blacks was “necessary” and by god he was good at doing what was “necessary.”
Militarily, Lee was a skilled tactician (by contemporary US standards… European observers familiar with Crimea were aghast at the life-wasting Napoleonic nonsense they saw from both sides), but he had strategic blind spots that had him ultimately fighting a war the South was poorly suited for. Now, sure, he probably was the best General available at the start of the war, but not by so wide a margin as people like to claim, and personal lionization of Lee is another Lost Cause ratfuck.
“The Guns of the South” by Harry Turtledove. Fun little science fiction where Lee wins the War with a little help…