i have a couple of ace friends into BDSM, i myself am somewhere on the ace spectrum. And i can tell you that BDSM can be enjoyed without sex or pain, power dynamics is where the best sauce is at
The way I usually describe it as an asexual guy is that there’s basically noone I find hot. That doesn’t mean they’re the opposite. It just like a sense I lack or a color I can’t see. I just don’t feel sexual attraction. But I do still like people based on other types of attraction and sex is still fun. For me platonic attraction is the main criteria for sexual partners. It’s just a fun activity between close friends like watching a movie or playing a board game.
That’s not to say that there aren’t asexual people who don’t like sex because those people do exist, but how much a person likes sex is on the sex repulsion to sex favorable axis and is only tangentally related to asexuality.
Could you elaborate further on platonic attraction? The internet says a platonic relationship is a relationship without romance or sex. This seems to contradict with it being a criteria for sexual partners for you but maybe I’m confusing things
I guess platonic isn’t the right word but it’s the closest I could think of at the time. I guess maybe emotional attraction? A person I care deeply about who I enjoy being around and feels the same towards me. Basically a relationship for me is just a best friend who I also happen to have sex with and thats what I look for personally.
But the main thing is the lack of sexual attraction. Other sex favorable ace people may deal with things differently. I personally know one asexual aromantic woman who doesn’t care who she screws because like I said before, a lack of attraction doesn’t make people unattractive, it’s just null. So for her basically everyone is the same so she’ll just take whoever to meet her needs whenever she’s horny and just be done with it. From what I’ve seen in the ace community that definitely isn’t common but it is a good example of just how different the the stance on sex between different asexual people can be.
If you label a relationship as platonic, that usually serves to make it explicit that there’s no romance or sex going on, yes.
When talking about attraction though, we’re in the context of the split attraction model (look that up if you’re interested), and there, platonic attraction is treated not as the opposite of sexual attraction, but as its own axis for basically saying “how much do I want this person to be my friend”, without saying anything about how much you’re sexually attracted to the person.
If you want to properly reconcile the terms, think about it like this - a sexual/romantic relationship is one where the sexual/romantic attraction between the partners is the strongest force, whereas a platonic relationship is one where their platonic attraction is the strongest force.
I personally actually have a hard time seeing platonic and romantic attraction as separate axes, for me, romantic attraction just feels like an extension, a stronger form of platonic attraction.
for me, romantic attraction just feels like an extension, a stronger form of platonic attraction
Oh yes I’m completely with you on that one, i think… but then I also feel like for me personally sexual attraction is an extension of romantic attraction. It’s all about how you interpret your feelings I guess…
That’s a lot of it. Like sex is also just a good way to acheive intimacy with someone you care about.
The big thing for asexual people is how you view people you aren’t already attracted to in other ways. Most people can find people they barely know sexually attractive. For example celebrity crushes or finding a certain porn model hot. For an asexual person that is a foreign concept. I’ve never seen someone and desired to have sex with them because of how they look. It’s not that we don’t know when people are good looking but we don’t really feel anything towards them just because they are. That’s also not to say asexual people never watch porn it’s just that when we do it’s about the act taking place not the people in it.
Yeah that makes sense. I’m not sure about sex but I definitely can desire intimacy only based on looks or general vibe so then I guess I actually do feel some kind of romantic attraction separately from platonic attraction.
What’s the difference between that and being demisexual? I identify as demi, but now I’m wondering if I misunderstood something, because I relate to what you said.
I actually just saw this (app being screwy). To answer your question I also identify as demi. It’s just that demi is a microlabel under the ace umbrella and allos usually don’t know what demisexuality is so unless I’m in a specifically ace community I just identify as ace to keep things simple. Demi is also basically just “ace until proven otherwise” so the difference in nonexistent for anyone I’m not already in a relationship with.
There’s also the fact that I’m still not sure if I really feel sexual attraction in the demi way or if I just crave intimacy with someone I am otherwise attracted to and sex is one of the most intimate things you can do with someone. I’m strongly leaning towards the latter but it’s a tricky distinction to make. I can want to have sex with someone but for me that desire doesn’t feel much different from wanting to cuddle with them nonsexually. So when it comes to my actual behavior I fit the demi label better but when it comes to how I think then I actually fit the asexual label better.
Demisexuality is under the asexuality umbrella, so it should seem relatable.
If you do experience sexual attraction towards those you are close to then that would be demi. If you want to have sex despite lack of sexual attraction, then that would be black-stripe ace.
The food analogy is the comparison I’ve seen people use to explain what sexual attraction is. Hunger is like libido and has little to nothing to do with sexual attraction. Sexual attraction would be like when someone brings out a fresh cake and you need to have a piece even if you just ate and are not hungry. I guess demi in this analogy would mean you wouldn’t feel that way unless you already knew that specific dessert well. But if you just eat tasty desserts when you are bored, because you like the taste but don’t have the mouthwatering reaction to it being presented, because the person who made it is important to you and you feel eating it’s a way to bond with them, etc, you could still be a black-stripe ace.
That said, what counts as sexual attraction has confused me a lot despite spending a fair bit of time reading people trying to explain it.
Anyways, if demi is a functionally useful label, there no need to change. In-practice real-world usefulness of language is more important than weirdos on the Internet trying to be precise in the meanings of words.
BDSM != sex, even if the two are heavily connected in a lot of people’s minds. I’ve played with both tops and bottoms that were ace/het/LGBT, and there was not anything sexual there. Hell, one of my fave experiences was bottoming for a lesbian top who enjoyed beating on dudes.
BDSM is not inherently sexual, even if there can be a lot of sexuality involved.
I love getting beat by confident women (presenting people), and never expect anything more than that. Being somewhat demi helps a lot with that aspect, but it’s just basic respect for an ephemeral play partner in my mind.
BDSM is much less about sex and much more about the power dynamic. Kinks are, by definition, having sexual arousal from non genital things. So while asexuals might not be interested in fuckin or getting fucked, other things might cause arousal.
So, technically speaking, an ace individual cannot find someone sexy? They can have sex with someone for the sake of having sex, be it for bond or pleasure or whatnot, but from what you’re saying they do not show any sexual attraction towards any demographic of people?
There are grey-aces (whom are still aces; black-stripe ace sometimes is used to refer to those with no sexual attraction) whom experience some sexual attraction some of the time.
But there’s a lot of aces who are surprised to realize sexual attraction is something people actually experience.
I always feel a bit confused by the name, and wonder whether it will eventually see itself focused or broadened further. Sexuality is a spectrum, but “asexual” doesn’t seem, overtly, to include sexual desire given its literal meaning. I do love the names of the sub-identities associated with it, though. Each one’s intention and definition feels apparent and up to date.
Sexualities generally refer to sexual attraction. Homosexuals are sexually attracted to people have the same gender, not to repeating the same sex acts over and over and heterosexuality is about attraction to people with different genders, not to novelty sex acts. Pansexual does not mean attraction to pans not to literally everyone or everything. Taking the words too literally is not really useful.
The differentiation of the ace/allo axis and the sex-favorable/sex-repulsed axis is particularly useful for aces, but it still has its use for allos as well (some people who have PTSD related to sexual activity may be sex repulsed, but can still experience sexual attraction). Lots of reasons to engage in and enjoy sex other than attraction to a specific person. Even allos often engage in sex with those whom they aren’t attracted to.
The major ace subreddits regularly had issues with sex-favorable people complaining about all the posts being sex-negative and sex-repulsed people (sometime simultaneously) complaining about too much sex-positive content. Would be more amusing if those types of posts didn’t waste so much space…
My sexual preference Is “no” and I have to say that instead of asexual because sexual people have decided that the prefix “a” in front of the word “sexual” does not mean “not sexual”.
What used to be safe spaces for people whose sexual preference is “no” are now filled with people whose sexual preference is “yes, but I don’t feel horny by looking at people”.
And if anyone dare speaks up they get bullied, called acephobic, and told to just accept asexual people are sexual too and how dare we say please use a different label for that.
I am far from the only one who’s noticed this. It also leads to things like romantic asexuals (people who want a romantic relationship just without sex) having a harder time than they already did because people are learning “Oh your ace? But you’ll have sex for ME, right?”
Why can’t aces be both? The “sexual” in sexual orientations has always referred to attraction. Sex repulsed aces are like victim-playing US Christians in most of the interactions I see. They bully and make fun of anyone who has sex and then play the victim when asked to not insult others.
Why do other orientations get to be easy to understand, but the ones that just want to say ‘no’ absolutely must be comfortable in the same label as yet another ’yes’?
What is wrong with having graysexuality and asexuality be as separate as homosexuality and heterosexuality?
Why do people want to force others to be comfortable with what they’re not comfortable with?
Why is it so important to dismiss and erase people who just don’t have a sexuality that it’s acceptable to take over their one safe word and sexualize it?
I genuinely find antisex spaces more welcoming than asexual spaces and I hate that. Because people born without sexuality often don’t care about other people having sex. It’s normal, it’s natural, it’s fine, it’s just not our thing. So why do people insist on sexual themes in a community started to be safe for those who are just born not sexual?
Many of us already feel broken when we don’t get horny as teens. Yes, we’re freaks. We’re weirdos. We’re biological failures.
We create a space to feel not broken. To vent among others born the same. So why take that away? Why take away the one safe term for people who already struggle with feeling like something is wrong with them by coming in and saying that people who DO like sex are the same label and the ones who don’t want sex at all are outsiders among outsiders?
It hurts. It genuinely hurts to finally find others like you, to then be told that no, you’re still a weird broken minority even in this supposedly “fitting” label.
Why is it so important to have a special label that it’s worth hurting the people it was made for to make sure more people can claim it?
If you’re queer you should be supporting us aces, not acting like we’re some sort of anomaly yeah? It may not be your cuppa but we’re all on the same side here
Sexuality in general is best seen as a spectrum, and that even applies to asexuality. I’ve met folks who only find sexual attraction in people they are intimately familiar with (can’t whack the nasty with any random people, they gotta trust and be comfortable and familiar with a partner). Others have a complete lack of sexual interest and arousal. I, myself, do have an active libido, but no actual interest in sex itself thanks to bad events in my past.
Aces can be into kink. There’s things like ace BSDM communities /shrug.
Asexual BDSM is just consentual torture lol
i have a couple of ace friends into BDSM, i myself am somewhere on the ace spectrum. And i can tell you that BDSM can be enjoyed without sex or pain, power dynamics is where the best sauce is at
I’ll need that explained more if you don’t mind.
I thought the whole point of asexual was you’re just not interested in sex or anything relevant to that?
Asexual ≠ Not Liking Sex
Asexual = Not Feeling Sexual Attraction
The way I usually describe it as an asexual guy is that there’s basically noone I find hot. That doesn’t mean they’re the opposite. It just like a sense I lack or a color I can’t see. I just don’t feel sexual attraction. But I do still like people based on other types of attraction and sex is still fun. For me platonic attraction is the main criteria for sexual partners. It’s just a fun activity between close friends like watching a movie or playing a board game.
That’s not to say that there aren’t asexual people who don’t like sex because those people do exist, but how much a person likes sex is on the sex repulsion to sex favorable axis and is only tangentally related to asexuality.
This is really helpful thank you
Could you elaborate further on platonic attraction? The internet says a platonic relationship is a relationship without romance or sex. This seems to contradict with it being a criteria for sexual partners for you but maybe I’m confusing things
I guess platonic isn’t the right word but it’s the closest I could think of at the time. I guess maybe emotional attraction? A person I care deeply about who I enjoy being around and feels the same towards me. Basically a relationship for me is just a best friend who I also happen to have sex with and thats what I look for personally.
But the main thing is the lack of sexual attraction. Other sex favorable ace people may deal with things differently. I personally know one asexual aromantic woman who doesn’t care who she screws because like I said before, a lack of attraction doesn’t make people unattractive, it’s just null. So for her basically everyone is the same so she’ll just take whoever to meet her needs whenever she’s horny and just be done with it. From what I’ve seen in the ace community that definitely isn’t common but it is a good example of just how different the the stance on sex between different asexual people can be.
Isn’t that just romantic attraction?
If you label a relationship as platonic, that usually serves to make it explicit that there’s no romance or sex going on, yes.
When talking about attraction though, we’re in the context of the split attraction model (look that up if you’re interested), and there, platonic attraction is treated not as the opposite of sexual attraction, but as its own axis for basically saying “how much do I want this person to be my friend”, without saying anything about how much you’re sexually attracted to the person.
If you want to properly reconcile the terms, think about it like this - a sexual/romantic relationship is one where the sexual/romantic attraction between the partners is the strongest force, whereas a platonic relationship is one where their platonic attraction is the strongest force.
I personally actually have a hard time seeing platonic and romantic attraction as separate axes, for me, romantic attraction just feels like an extension, a stronger form of platonic attraction.
I guess that explains it, thank you.
Oh yes I’m completely with you on that one, i think… but then I also feel like for me personally sexual attraction is an extension of romantic attraction. It’s all about how you interpret your feelings I guess…
That’s a lot of it. Like sex is also just a good way to acheive intimacy with someone you care about.
The big thing for asexual people is how you view people you aren’t already attracted to in other ways. Most people can find people they barely know sexually attractive. For example celebrity crushes or finding a certain porn model hot. For an asexual person that is a foreign concept. I’ve never seen someone and desired to have sex with them because of how they look. It’s not that we don’t know when people are good looking but we don’t really feel anything towards them just because they are. That’s also not to say asexual people never watch porn it’s just that when we do it’s about the act taking place not the people in it.
Yeah that makes sense. I’m not sure about sex but I definitely can desire intimacy only based on looks or general vibe so then I guess I actually do feel some kind of romantic attraction separately from platonic attraction.
What’s the difference between that and being demisexual? I identify as demi, but now I’m wondering if I misunderstood something, because I relate to what you said.
I actually just saw this (app being screwy). To answer your question I also identify as demi. It’s just that demi is a microlabel under the ace umbrella and allos usually don’t know what demisexuality is so unless I’m in a specifically ace community I just identify as ace to keep things simple. Demi is also basically just “ace until proven otherwise” so the difference in nonexistent for anyone I’m not already in a relationship with.
There’s also the fact that I’m still not sure if I really feel sexual attraction in the demi way or if I just crave intimacy with someone I am otherwise attracted to and sex is one of the most intimate things you can do with someone. I’m strongly leaning towards the latter but it’s a tricky distinction to make. I can want to have sex with someone but for me that desire doesn’t feel much different from wanting to cuddle with them nonsexually. So when it comes to my actual behavior I fit the demi label better but when it comes to how I think then I actually fit the asexual label better.
That’s a great explanation, thank you!
Demisexuality is under the asexuality umbrella, so it should seem relatable.
If you do experience sexual attraction towards those you are close to then that would be demi. If you want to have sex despite lack of sexual attraction, then that would be black-stripe ace.
The food analogy is the comparison I’ve seen people use to explain what sexual attraction is. Hunger is like libido and has little to nothing to do with sexual attraction. Sexual attraction would be like when someone brings out a fresh cake and you need to have a piece even if you just ate and are not hungry. I guess demi in this analogy would mean you wouldn’t feel that way unless you already knew that specific dessert well. But if you just eat tasty desserts when you are bored, because you like the taste but don’t have the mouthwatering reaction to it being presented, because the person who made it is important to you and you feel eating it’s a way to bond with them, etc, you could still be a black-stripe ace.
That said, what counts as sexual attraction has confused me a lot despite spending a fair bit of time reading people trying to explain it.
Anyways, if demi is a functionally useful label, there no need to change. In-practice real-world usefulness of language is more important than weirdos on the Internet trying to be precise in the meanings of words.
BDSM != sex, even if the two are heavily connected in a lot of people’s minds. I’ve played with both tops and bottoms that were ace/het/LGBT, and there was not anything sexual there. Hell, one of my fave experiences was bottoming for a lesbian top who enjoyed beating on dudes.
BDSM is not inherently sexual, even if there can be a lot of sexuality involved.
am lesbian who enjoys beating on dudes (impact play w/ anyone tbh)
shoutout to kinky guys who bottom for domme lezzies but still respect their sexuality :]
10000%
I love getting beat by confident women (presenting people), and never expect anything more than that. Being somewhat demi helps a lot with that aspect, but it’s just basic respect for an ephemeral play partner in my mind.
Lots of kinky stuff isn’t sex.
BDSM is much less about sex and much more about the power dynamic. Kinks are, by definition, having sexual arousal from non genital things. So while asexuals might not be interested in fuckin or getting fucked, other things might cause arousal.
Ace is about sexual attraction, not interest in sex. You can be ace and love sex and you can be allo and be sex repulsed.
So, technically speaking, an ace individual cannot find someone sexy? They can have sex with someone for the sake of having sex, be it for bond or pleasure or whatnot, but from what you’re saying they do not show any sexual attraction towards any demographic of people?
Basically.
There are grey-aces (whom are still aces; black-stripe ace sometimes is used to refer to those with no sexual attraction) whom experience some sexual attraction some of the time.
But there’s a lot of aces who are surprised to realize sexual attraction is something people actually experience.
Can I be a grey heterosexual if I only fuck guys some of the time?
I always feel a bit confused by the name, and wonder whether it will eventually see itself focused or broadened further. Sexuality is a spectrum, but “asexual” doesn’t seem, overtly, to include sexual desire given its literal meaning. I do love the names of the sub-identities associated with it, though. Each one’s intention and definition feels apparent and up to date.
Sexualities generally refer to sexual attraction. Homosexuals are sexually attracted to people have the same gender, not to repeating the same sex acts over and over and heterosexuality is about attraction to people with different genders, not to novelty sex acts. Pansexual does not mean attraction to pans not to literally everyone or everything. Taking the words too literally is not really useful.
The differentiation of the ace/allo axis and the sex-favorable/sex-repulsed axis is particularly useful for aces, but it still has its use for allos as well (some people who have PTSD related to sexual activity may be sex repulsed, but can still experience sexual attraction). Lots of reasons to engage in and enjoy sex other than attraction to a specific person. Even allos often engage in sex with those whom they aren’t attracted to.
The major ace subreddits regularly had issues with sex-favorable people complaining about all the posts being sex-negative and sex-repulsed people (sometime simultaneously) complaining about too much sex-positive content. Would be more amusing if those types of posts didn’t waste so much space…
one of my exes was a sex repulsed allo and unfortunately that was part of why we broke up
No sex in a relationship kills the relationship.
Bro this makes 0 sense
I’m queer and fully agree
My sexual preference Is “no” and I have to say that instead of asexual because sexual people have decided that the prefix “a” in front of the word “sexual” does not mean “not sexual”.
What used to be safe spaces for people whose sexual preference is “no” are now filled with people whose sexual preference is “yes, but I don’t feel horny by looking at people”.
And if anyone dare speaks up they get bullied, called acephobic, and told to just accept asexual people are sexual too and how dare we say please use a different label for that.
I am far from the only one who’s noticed this. It also leads to things like romantic asexuals (people who want a romantic relationship just without sex) having a harder time than they already did because people are learning “Oh your ace? But you’ll have sex for ME, right?”
Why can’t aces be both? The “sexual” in sexual orientations has always referred to attraction. Sex repulsed aces are like victim-playing US Christians in most of the interactions I see. They bully and make fun of anyone who has sex and then play the victim when asked to not insult others.
Why does it have to be both?
Why do other orientations get to be easy to understand, but the ones that just want to say ‘no’ absolutely must be comfortable in the same label as yet another ’yes’?
What is wrong with having graysexuality and asexuality be as separate as homosexuality and heterosexuality?
Why do people want to force others to be comfortable with what they’re not comfortable with?
Why is it so important to dismiss and erase people who just don’t have a sexuality that it’s acceptable to take over their one safe word and sexualize it?
I genuinely find antisex spaces more welcoming than asexual spaces and I hate that. Because people born without sexuality often don’t care about other people having sex. It’s normal, it’s natural, it’s fine, it’s just not our thing. So why do people insist on sexual themes in a community started to be safe for those who are just born not sexual?
Many of us already feel broken when we don’t get horny as teens. Yes, we’re freaks. We’re weirdos. We’re biological failures.
We create a space to feel not broken. To vent among others born the same. So why take that away? Why take away the one safe term for people who already struggle with feeling like something is wrong with them by coming in and saying that people who DO like sex are the same label and the ones who don’t want sex at all are outsiders among outsiders?
It hurts. It genuinely hurts to finally find others like you, to then be told that no, you’re still a weird broken minority even in this supposedly “fitting” label.
Why is it so important to have a special label that it’s worth hurting the people it was made for to make sure more people can claim it?
If you’re queer you should be supporting us aces, not acting like we’re some sort of anomaly yeah? It may not be your cuppa but we’re all on the same side here
Sexuality in general is best seen as a spectrum, and that even applies to asexuality. I’ve met folks who only find sexual attraction in people they are intimately familiar with (can’t whack the nasty with any random people, they gotta trust and be comfortable and familiar with a partner). Others have a complete lack of sexual interest and arousal. I, myself, do have an active libido, but no actual interest in sex itself thanks to bad events in my past.
“Horny ace” is one of the more difficult sexualities to be, but it definitely does exist.