Are we human?
www.theregister.com

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.zip/post/68752761 which was cross-posted from: https://sh.itjust.works/post/64103917

I thought about saying “you know it’s a grift when they collect personal information and leak it.” According to their Bible, you don’t need an app to pray. They say church (or a covenant, I forget, it’s been 30+ years since I read the KJV) is when any two people come together to talk about Jesus (sorry!). So, where does an app fit in? And why does that app need your personally identifiable information (referred to as PII in industry). Wouldn’t an all-knowing God already have it?

But you don’t have to know it’s a grift… I feel like this is proof the Vatican (or whoever made this app on their behalf, and thus speak on their behalf… and the Pope allegedly speaks on God’s behalf) themselves know it’s a grift. Because why would they need your PII?

I know, fools and their money are soon parted… just saw this on /all and figured the Fediverse’s top Atheism comm should have it.

  • rootEnglish
    12·
    3 天前

    an otherwise impossible act done by God

    The Eucharistic Miracle of Buenos Aires

    • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
      2·
      3 天前

      But you never proved or defined “god”.

      Anyway, even catholic scientists admit your example is not a miracle: https://drjulesgomes.substack.com/p/catholic-scientists-debunk-assertions

      Catholic scientists are now urging the faithful to be cautious about claims that eucharistic miracles have been scientifically proven, as unconsecrated hosts tested under similar conditions have also shown similar “bleeding” appearances.

      Peer-reviewed studies published by Catholic scientists who believe in Christ’s real presence in the Eucharist have also dismissed assertions that the miracles were validated by research carried out by the World Health Organization (WHO) and the United Nations (UN).

      Would you like to try another? Spoiler: they’re all bullshit, magic isn’t real. Please use your brain.

      • rootEnglish
        21·
        3 天前

        they APPEAR to be bleeding due to serratia marascens, a red pigmented bacterium.

        But multiple tests for serratia are done in the case of eucharistic miracles

        • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
          1·
          3 天前

          But without detailed reports? You just take them at their word?

          You believe god is all-powerful, yes? And you believe this is how he chooses to interact with us?

          • rootEnglish
            11·
            2 天前

            He has many ways of interacting with us

            • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
              1·
              2 天前

              How do you know? Everything you’ve shown so far is natural phenomena and humans making shit up.

              Why do you pretend there is a god?

              People are dying for your mistakes.

              • rootEnglish
                11·
                1 天前

                who created the natural phenomena?

                • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
                  1·
                  1 天前

                  Why are you assuming it was created by someone? There is no evidence to suggest that.

                  If god doesn’t need a first cause, why does the universe?

                  If the universe needs a first cause, why doesn’t god?

                  All you have is special pleading and god of the gaps.

                  Those are fallacies, not evidence.

                  • rootEnglish
                    11·
                    24 小时前

                    Because God and the universe are not equal. They are of different natures entirely. I mean omnipotence IS hard to comprehend for us since we’re human

        • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
          2·
          3 天前

          Interesting, I’d love to see the report. Ah, it’s linked at the bottom of the article. Hmm, the link is unsafe, certificate expired two years ago. I proceeded with caution and saw… a 404 error.

          There is no evidence of this supposed miracle.

            • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
              2·
              3 天前

              That is a letter, not a report.

              I have not been able to find the report myself, but other scientists have commented on it, including catholic “scientists”:

              DR. KELLY KEARSE, A CHEMIST SPECIALIZING IN BLOOD RESEARCH AND IMMUNOLOGY AND A TEACHER AT KNOXVILLE CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOL, IS CALLING FOR THE USE OF MORE ACCURATE RESEARCH METHODS IN INVESTIGATING THE SHROUD OF TURIN AND OTHER RELIGIOUS PHENOMENA THOUGHT TO BE DIVINE.

              Dr. Kearse points out important natural explanations that were never addressed. Until those are ruled out as causes, it is premature to claim a miracle.

              It seems remarkable that all five test for the same, rare blood type. But there is a problem: the A and B antigens are not unique to humans. Since the 1960s, biologists have known that bacteria cells also have A and B antigens on their surfaces. Hence, if a sample is contaminated with bacteria, even if it contains no blood at all, it could still show a type AB blood result in this test.

              A “very low concentration of human DNA” is indicative of handling contamination. In forensic DNA tests, trace amounts of DNA from humans who touch a sample can be unintentionally amplified, and reports say the hosts were touched by several people.

              https://etcatholic.org/2025/01/exaggerations-and-eucharistic-miracles/

              • rootEnglish
                12·
                3 天前

                "It seems remarkable that all five test for the same, rare blood type. But there is a problem: the A and B antigens are not unique to humans. Since the 1960s, biologists have known that bacteria cells also have A and B antigens on their surfaces. Hence, if a sample is contaminated with bacteria, even if it contains no blood at all, it could still show a type AB blood result in this test.

                Yet, without anyone ever checking for bacteria as the explanation, the claim about the blood type is often repeated as miraculous."

                They do check for Serratia, thats literally the FIRST thing they do

                Dr. Kearse devised, for the first time ever, a set of control experiments. He obtained unconsecrated Communion wafers and processed them according to the same conditions described above. He left them in a dusty, dark corner for several days and then stored them in water at ambient temperature and humidity for seven to 10 days. Approximately 15 percent of the control wafers formed a gelatinous red substance on the surface, like the photos from the eucharistic miracle reports.

                Microscopy, fluorescence, and molecular biology techniques showed the reddish substance to be fungus and bacteria. Again, this is a natural explanation that was not checked but easily could be. Dr. Kearse presents a variety of tests showing that blood can easily be distinguished from microorganisms. As before, genetic testing would ultimately confirm what the red substances are and whether they have a single origin.

                They test for serratia

                The other AB results are from cloths believed to have touched Jesus at the crucifixion (the relics): the Shroud of Turin (a burial garment), the Tunic of Argenteuil (a seamless robe), and the Sudarium of Oviedo (a face cloth).

                Also, Sokolka went through electron microscopy, and serratia tests.

                " Two independent university professors. Professor Maria Elżbieta Sobaniec-Łotowska and Professor Stanisław Sulkowski, both of the Department of Pathomorphology at the Medical University of Białystok, conducted independent analyses and reached the same conclusion — without consulting each other.

                • The tissue is cardiac muscle. Both professors identified the substance as human cardiac muscle tissue (myocardium) based on multiple diagnostic features: segmentation and fragmentation of muscle fibers, communicating junctions characteristic of heart muscle, centrally positioned cellular nuclei, and contraction nodes.
                • Electron microscopy confirmation. Electron microscope imaging revealed intact myofibril filaments and junction outlines — structures visible only at extreme magnification that are uniquely characteristic of cardiac muscle. This level of structural preservation in unpreserved tissue exposed to water is, by established science, impossible.
                • No decomposition. The tissue showed no signs of autolysis (cellular self-destruction) — a process that begins within hours of tissue death and is accelerated by water exposure. The professors explicitly noted that a bacterial culture would deteriorate within a week under similar conditions, yet this tissue remained intact for months.
                • Tissue fused with bread at fiber level. Microscopic examination showed that the cardiac tissue was intertwined with the bread fibers of the Host at a structural level — not sitting on the surface, but integrated into the substrate. The scientists stated this phenomenon could not be replicated or explained by any known natural process.
                • Official Church confirmation. On October 14, 2009, the Metropolitan Curia of Białystok issued an official statement confirming the scientific findings and declaring that the event “does not contradict the faith of the Church, but rather confirms it.”
                • Consistent with the global pattern. The identification of cardiac muscle tissue places Sokółka in a direct line with Lanciano (1970 analysis), Buenos Aires (2004 analysis), and Tixtla (2009–2012 analysis) — four independent scientific investigations across three centuries of miracles, all finding the same tissue type."
                • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
                  1·
                  3 天前

                  Sokolka went through electron microscopy, and serratia tests.

                  How do we know that?

                  I found a Polish newspaper article suggesting the research was amateurishly performed and should have been more extensive. I used the auto-translate feature that my browser has, I can’t guarantee accuracy.

                  https://www.rp.pl/kosciol/art7471901-co-sie-naprawde-stalo-w-sokolce

                  What kind of research did Professor Sulkowski perform? It’s unclear exactly. He enigmatically replies that it fell within the scope of his specialty.

                  However, he refuses to say how the nuclei were arranged in the fiber of the tissue he examined. “Such questions fall within the purview of the appropriate commission investigating the miracle,” he says, cutting the conversation short.

                  DNA testing would precisely indicate whether the tissue being examined is human or animal, and whether it’s male or female. “We would determine with a high degree of probability what region of the world it comes from. We would dispel any doubts,” assures Professor Śliwka.

                  Prof. Chyczewski: – The Archbishop was not interested in conducting such research. I was told that since the material was believed to be of miraculous origin, there was no need to bother with it any further.

                  Did he even publish his results? There should be images, evidence. So far we still just have claims.

            • rootEnglish
              11·
              3 天前

              this is the buenos aires one

          • SnoopSqueak@lemmy.todayEnglish
            1·
            3 天前

            Another polish article about this: https://naukawpolsce.pl/aktualnosci/news%2C367624%2Cuniwersytet-medyczny-odcina-sie-od-badan-ws-cudu-w-sokolce.html

            The Medical University of Białystok officially distances itself from the results of these studies and emphasizes that the university does not endorse them.

            One of the most valuable things about science is the consistent ability for anyone to repeat the experiment and get the same result. Why does the catholic church keep hiding from showing us that it is true?

            “We did not do this as a university,” Chyczewski told PAP, adding that the tests were conducted illegally, “quietly,” outside the official channels. They took place at the Academic Department of Pathomorphological Diagnostics. Chyczewski emphasizes that the university was not commissioned to perform these tests, and the study was not registered anywhere. “Please do not attribute the diagnosis to any specific department operating within the institution called the Medical University,” Chyczewski wrote in his statement.

            Why didn’t they collaborate with the university, if they have legitimate evidence?

            Professor Chyczewski believes that his colleagues who made the diagnosis made a “schoolboy error” by trying to combine theology and biology, which, in his opinion, is impossible.

            Because biology is evident and theology is not.

            Just a few weeks ago, when the news of the tests became public, Archbishop Ozorowski said: “We are dealing with an extremely subtle matter. If we confess that this is the body of Christ, we cannot just cut it into pieces and subject it to tests. We must exercise caution and a certain fear.”

            Fear of your own savior? Fear of your “loving” god’s punishment for proving his own existence? This same god who once loved when his own creations were eviscerated and cooked now is squeamish? Ohhhh, no, I get it, he’s only offended when it’s his OWN flesh that gets… Wait, what about Jesus, though? He was willing to make that sacrifice, but not this one?

            Please stop defending catholicism. It is a death cult. People are dying for your false beliefs.

            • rootEnglish
              11·
              2 天前

              1. Almost all analysis of genetic material of the Relics and eucharistic miracles showed that the blood type is AB, the same result.

              2. In his opinion?