“The MRAP that was reutilized through the 1033 program was declared excess by the Defense Department, it was not purchased using taxpayer funds. It was transferred to Prosper Police Department as a conditional loan, and it will be returned to the DOD when Prosper PD no longer requires it,” according to the Defense Logistics Agency.
So the taxpayers did pay for it, just not only local taxpayers. It was taxpayers nationwide through the DoD budget, proving they don’t actually need everything we’re paying for. So the rest of the country is paying for some bumblefuck police department to get an MRAP.
What is the supposed justification for this department “requiring” this MRAP be “loaned” to them? DOD equipment and functionality should NEVER be utilized by police. The two are different groups for a reason. If the police need assistance at that level, they can call in the National Guard for that help. That’s why they exist. There is no reason a local police department ever needs an MRAP.
To be fair, the military never wanted these. They were a political requirement because Congress wanted a war with zero casualties. But they failed at stopping casualties and they failed at being useful military vehicles because they couldn’t drive off road reliably. So we spent hundreds of billions on these things and now we have to replace them with vehicles that actually work off road and protect soldiers.
DOD equipment and functionality should NEVER be utilized by police. The two are different groups for a reason.
“There’s a reason you separate military and the police. One fights the enemies of the state, the other serves and protects the people. When the military becomes both, then the enemies of the state tend to become the people.” - Commander Adama in Battlestar Galactica
A bit idealistic in the police serving and protecting but I agree with the sentiment.
Literally the exact opposite. There is absolutely no scenario where these tools should be needed against American citizens. The fact police have them means they will be used against citizens already.
It’s so heavy that it destroys most rural roads, can’t be driven across most bridges, and it’s too big to maneuver safely in most urban areas. The department, aka the taxpayers, still have to foot the bill for gas, repairs, and maintenance as well as refitting it for police use. They can cost up to $70000 to refit which is already pretty damn close to the price of a fully loaded Tahoe. The department is also responsible for the cost of shipping the MRAP which can cost up to $150000 to airlift depending on the model.
There is literally no benefit to the police having these unless they regularly deal with land mines in their jurisdiction.
And even then, if it’s that much of a problem I’d go for the M-ATV that’s getting phased out as the L-ATV comes in. Failing that you’d go for the Caiman, Cougar, or Buffalo in route clearing setup if available. The Maxpro looks slick but it’s the earliest of the bunch and was a napkin design meant to field something as soon as possible, and it shows.
A semi, as in a proper tractor with fifth wheel, is usually about 20,000 lbs. Loaded with a trailer, it maxes out at 80,000 lbs before you need permits.
All of this information is publicly available and easily accessible. Maybe try doing 30 seconds of research.
Which is higher 20000 or 28000? The trailer isn’t really relevant since spreading the weight over additional axels makes it significantly less likely to damage roads.
Speaking of which, Texas roads have a single axel weight limit of 20000 lbs and a tandem axel limit of 32000 lbs. Under normal operation, a semi should be fine. A Maxpro can potentially reach the the tandem axel limit on its own and could put it’s full weight on a single axle if it his a speed bump going too fast.
Also, many rural roads and smaller bridges won’t accommodate a full size semi with or without a trailer. They certainly couldn’t handle the even heavier Maxpro.
Not even counting the fuel, the MAINTENANCE up keep on something like that is huge. Like ten times a Tahoe. Probably cost 30-40 grand a year just in up keep…
So the taxpayers did pay for it, just not only local taxpayers. It was taxpayers nationwide through the DoD budget, proving they don’t actually need everything we’re paying for. So the rest of the country is paying for some bumblefuck police department to get an MRAP.
What is the supposed justification for this department “requiring” this MRAP be “loaned” to them? DOD equipment and functionality should NEVER be utilized by police. The two are different groups for a reason. If the police need assistance at that level, they can call in the National Guard for that help. That’s why they exist. There is no reason a local police department ever needs an MRAP.
To be fair, the military never wanted these. They were a political requirement because Congress wanted a war with zero casualties. But they failed at stopping casualties and they failed at being useful military vehicles because they couldn’t drive off road reliably. So we spent hundreds of billions on these things and now we have to replace them with vehicles that actually work off road and protect soldiers.
“There’s a reason you separate military and the police. One fights the enemies of the state, the other serves and protects the people. When the military becomes both, then the enemies of the state tend to become the people.” - Commander Adama in Battlestar Galactica
A bit idealistic in the police serving and protecting but I agree with the sentiment.
Okay… then by that logic you’re ok with America’s defence forces being deployed against citizens?
Literally the exact opposite. There is absolutely no scenario where these tools should be needed against American citizens. The fact police have them means they will be used against citizens already.
Good police need good tools to respond to anything that could happen.
Imagine a 9/11 variation with an armed group instead of planes.
That’s going to need a rapid and powerful police response. Armed forces are not an option with such short notice.
The real issue you should concern yourself with the the quality of the police themselves, not the tools they used.
I’ll back you any day on that front.
Why not? It carries a lot of people amd equipment. Sure its overkill, but its cheaper than a tahoe.
It’s so heavy that it destroys most rural roads, can’t be driven across most bridges, and it’s too big to maneuver safely in most urban areas. The department, aka the taxpayers, still have to foot the bill for gas, repairs, and maintenance as well as refitting it for police use. They can cost up to $70000 to refit which is already pretty damn close to the price of a fully loaded Tahoe. The department is also responsible for the cost of shipping the MRAP which can cost up to $150000 to airlift depending on the model.
There is literally no benefit to the police having these unless they regularly deal with land mines in their jurisdiction.
And even then, if it’s that much of a problem I’d go for the M-ATV that’s getting phased out as the L-ATV comes in. Failing that you’d go for the Caiman, Cougar, or Buffalo in route clearing setup if available. The Maxpro looks slick but it’s the earliest of the bunch and was a napkin design meant to field something as soon as possible, and it shows.
Its no heavier than a semi
A semi weights 10000-25000lbs. A Maxpro weighs 28000-32000lbs.
All of this information is publicly available and easily accessible. Maybe try doing 30 seconds of research.
A semi, as in a proper tractor with fifth wheel, is usually about 20,000 lbs. Loaded with a trailer, it maxes out at 80,000 lbs before you need permits.
All of this information is publicly available and easily accessible. Maybe try doing 30 seconds of research.
Which is higher 20000 or 28000? The trailer isn’t really relevant since spreading the weight over additional axels makes it significantly less likely to damage roads.
Speaking of which, Texas roads have a single axel weight limit of 20000 lbs and a tandem axel limit of 32000 lbs. Under normal operation, a semi should be fine. A Maxpro can potentially reach the the tandem axel limit on its own and could put it’s full weight on a single axle if it his a speed bump going too fast.
Also, many rural roads and smaller bridges won’t accommodate a full size semi with or without a trailer. They certainly couldn’t handle the even heavier Maxpro.
Not even counting the fuel, the MAINTENANCE up keep on something like that is huge. Like ten times a Tahoe. Probably cost 30-40 grand a year just in up keep…