• gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de
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    24 minutes ago

    For the past two months, Iran had been in diplomatic negotiations with the Trump administration, and both sides appeared to be getting closer to a deal that would drastically curtail Tehran’s enrichment of uranium and prevent any path to the bomb.

    Then Israel attacked. It acted less to pre-empt an Iranian bomb than to preempt American diplomacy.

  • TransplantedSconie@lemm.ee
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    8 hours ago

    Mistake: Yes.

    Help out Ukraine unintentionally: also yes.

    If the US attacks Iran, there goes Russias Shahed drone supplier.

    That’s why Tucker and Bannon are all up in arms about attacking Iran. That hurts Mother Russia

  • Optional@lemmy.world
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    7 hours ago

    But but but - I thought it was MISSION ACCOMPLISHED?!

    the guy got his picture in a flight suit and everything!

    • SnarkoPolo@lemmy.world
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      4 hours ago

      “freedom is on the march”

      And Americans ate it up like the crummy greasy fast food most of them live on.

      • vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works
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        4 hours ago

        Good comparison with fast food, plenty of folks consume propaganda for similar reasons. Just as there are food deserts there are also information deserts.

  • DarkDecay@lemmy.world
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    12 hours ago

    Well lets see. Dough brain trump is in charge, his defense secretary can’t use a messaging app and virtually everyone else in his administration is probably licking a window somewhere. Yes I think it will be a mistake

  • three_trains_in_a_trenchcoat@piefed.social
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    11 hours ago

    This is going to be the breaking point if we actually put boots on the ground in Iran and don’t just engage in drone terrorism and bombing runs. More military action in the middle east is a ubiquitously unpopular platform, and wars that are perceived as pointless have almost always been devastating to ruling party / presidential support. Further, the US military has been struggling to hit its recruitment numbers for years now, and this isn’t going to help that. It also stretches the government’s attention even further, and makes it more vulnerable to dissident activity at home.

  • Placebonickname@lemmy.world
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    12 hours ago

    I agree Iraq was a mistake, but I believe Iraq was a mistake based on intelligence failure - which UK, Australia, Japan, and others agreed to participate. That failure took two years to complete and the Us gave Iraq tome to cooperate with UN weapons inspection teams. Yes, a mistake - but a mistake that the US did not do unilaterally.

    Trump isn’t going to garner support from other countries, wait for the UN, or examine Tulsi G’s info on Iran nukes - he just wants to swing his military like a giant penis.

    • Saleh@feddit.org
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      11 hours ago

      Iraq wasn’t an “intelligence failure”. There was tampered “evidence”, singular sources blown out of proportion instead of their veracity challenged and wild computer animations to drive the point home with the public.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_Iraqi_mobile_weapons_laboratories

      They knew they were lying, just that today it is even more brazen. The US needed to produce images of “strength” after 9/11 so it was clear they will invade someone. They didn’t invade their allies in Saudi Arabia despite most of the perpetrators being Saudi nationals. It was clear to seasoned politicians that this is a sham aimed at producing the right images and seize the opportunity to reshape the region.

    • NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io
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      12 hours ago

      I agree Iraq was a mistake, but I believe Iraq was a mistake based on intelligence failure

      If it was just an intelligence failure half the country wouldn’t be railing against it. Iraq was also justified by lies, just slightly better packaged lies.

      • BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world
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        12 hours ago

        Our own intelligence agencies were at odds with each other. Part of the justification for going into Iraq was their supposed support for terrorist groups which was shakey at best.

        • DeathsEmbrace@lemmy.world
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          11 hours ago

          Bullshit the CIA literally told the administration and they lied on stand in the UN to start the war. Don’t act like the only two conflicts of interests that made billions didn’t get anything out of starting the greedy endeavor called the Iraq War.

        • Placebonickname@lemmy.world
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          11 hours ago

          In the late 1970s and early 80s Iraq under the control of Saddam Hussein used chemical weapons, including mustard, gas to attack Iran.

          Under Saddam Hussein Iraq also used chemical weapons to attack a minority ethnic population called the Kurdish in their own borders

          And in the 1990’s Saddam, invaded another country without cause.

          All those facts together, it felt totally reasonable to believe that Saddam Hussein had chemical weapons and was willing to use them or give them to terrorist

          I know that this is contrary to the popular message in the media these days, but it’s a time living through the actual event, there was another perspective to this whole story

          

          • Saleh@feddit.org
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            7 hours ago

            You mean the chemical weapons program built by Germany and the UK, supplied with precursors by further countries such as the Netherlands, Singapore and India?

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_chemical_weapons_program

            As part of Project 922, German firms helped build Iraqi chemical weapons facilities such as laboratories, bunkers, an administrative building, and first production buildings in the early 1980s under the cover of a pesticide plant. Other German firms sent 1,027 tons of precursors of mustard gas, sarin, tabun, and tear gasses in all. This work allowed Iraq to produce 150 tons of mustard agent and 60 tons of Tabun in 1983 and 1984 respectively, continuing throughout the decade. All told, 52% of Iraq’s international chemical weapon equipment was of German origin. One of the contributions was a £14m chlorine plant known as “Falluja 2”, built by Uhde Ltd, then a UK subsidiary of German chemical company Hoechst AG;[6] the plant was given financial guarantees by the UK’s Export Credits Guarantee Department despite official UK recognition of a “strong possibility” the plant would be used to make mustard gas.[7] The guarantees led to UK government payment of £300,000 to Uhde in 1990 after completion of the plant was interrupted by the first Gulf War. Saddam’s son Qusay was said to have been put in charge of concealing chemical weapons from international inspectors.[8][7] In 1994 and 1996 three people were convicted in Germany of export offenses.[9]

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_chemical_attack#International_sources_for_technology_and_chemical_precursors

            The know-how and material for developing chemical weapons were obtained by Saddam’s regime from foreign sources.[53] Most precursors for chemical weapons production came from Singapore (4,515 tons), the Netherlands (4,261 tons), Egypt (2,400 tons), India (2,343 tons), and West Germany (1,027 tons). One Indian company, Exomet Plastics, sent 2,292 tons of precursor chemicals to Iraq. Singapore-based firm Kim Al-Khaleej, affiliated to the United Arab Emirates, supplied more than 4,500 tons of VX, sarin and mustard gas precursors and production equipment to Iraq.[54] Dieter Backfisch, managing director of West German company Karl Kolb GmbH, was quoted by saying in 1989 that “for people in Germany poison gas is something quite terrible, but this does not worry customers abroad.”[

            The chemical weapon attacks that the CIA tried to blame on Iran, despite knowing it came from Saddam?

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_chemical_attack#Allegations_of_Iranian_involvement

            Joost Hiltermann, who was the principal researcher for Human Rights Watch between 1992 and 1994, conducted a two-year study of the massacre, including a field investigation in northern Iraq. Hiltermann writes: “Analysis of thousands of captured Iraqi secret police documents and declassified U.S. government documents, as well as interviews with scores of Kurdish survivors, senior Iraqi defectors and retired U.S. intelligence officers, show (1) that Iraq carried out the attack on Halabja, and (2) that the United States, fully aware it was Iraq, accused Iran, Iraq’s enemy in a fierce war, of being partly responsible for the attack.”[30] This research concluded there were numerous other gas attacks, unquestionably perpetrated against the Kurds by the Iraqi armed forces.[62] In 2001, Jean Pascal Zanders of the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI)'s Chemical and Biological Warfare Project also dismissed the allegations, arguing that "The coloring of the victims is more suggestive of sarin, which was in Iraq’s arsenal.

            The West created the threat themselves as they were happy for Saddams Iraq to slaughter Iranians with these chemical weapons.

          • NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io
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            11 hours ago

            All those facts together, it felt totally reasonable to believe that Saddam Hussein had chemical weapons and was willing to use them or give them to terrorist

            Only if you ignore… literally everything else about the situation. “Felt reasonable” isn’t an excuse to start a fucking war.