I agree with you that the Epstein case is relatively small compared to the millions of people who Trump is causing to suffer. However, the Epstein files also seem to be the first thing that cracked his base of political support. It is a weakness that anyone against Trump should exploit, not because it’s the most important issue, but because it’s the one that is most likely to remove him from power.
Deporting immigrants, locking up trans people, outlawing abortion, destroying free speech and political opposition, supporting genocide… These are all things that his base WANTS. They rejoice in the suffering of the “other”. They care about the economy too, but they’re told dumb to realize that Trump is the problem.
That’s all well and good, but like I said, keep it the fuck out of serious conversation, especially on here. There aren’t gonna be many Trumpers on this platform, as leftists and queer people are such a major population that they’d struggle to tolerate it. At most there are very mild conservatives who are usually not beyond reaching with actual arguments. I would get this argument more if we were on a corpo platform, but on this one you’re just distracting from issues we actually care about.
You’re making a lot of broad assumptions about audiences. And “serious conversation”… My sibling in Satan this is c/politicalmemes.
These memes don’t just stay on Lemmy either. They get reposted all across the internet, printed on stickers and posters and t-shirts. The UK just jailed journalists last week for the terrible crime of projecting a picture of Trump and Epstein together on a building during Trump’s visit. It’s very much a topical issue that is heavily tied to broader issues of free speech and political corruption. And it’s not just about Trump- how many other powerful people are in those files that faced no consequences? This isn’t distracting from other issues- it’s a part of them. All of these other issues seem to always track back to billionaires promoting horrible inhuman behavior and fascism, so I don’t see how the Epstein files are distracting from anything.
I’m also critical of Biden and Garland for not doing more with this when they were in power. This isn’t
It doesn’t just happen here genius. I’ve seen such reaction images on news stories about the administration looking to label antifa as terrorists. This is a seriously scary move that will be used to silence any dissent, but apparently it’s all a fucking distraction from well established pedophilia by a man above the law.
I really I shouldn’t be surprised by the reaction here. If we’re talking about audience, I know a lot of people here are the ones who need to see this meme.
The thing I hate most about Lemmy is what a fucking circlejerk it is.
I know people are gonna read this and make deeply frowny faces and try to poke me with their little arrows but we have to get better about identifying what a fucking bubble we all fall into.
These kinds of sites are the same as what the right uses, but the left gets far less out of them for affecting change and good outcomes. They’re feed-troughs to get people gathered together, getting their feelings out of their system, without actually going out and challenging power and facing the opposition. It’s like when you have a great idea for a novel and you tell your bored friends all about it and that gets the inspiration out of your system so you never pursue it.
It is true that Lemmy sucks for having substantial reach. If I wanted to reach the largest possible audience for advocacy’s sake, I would use corpo socials. They optimize for the largest reach because that’s where they make money, so it’s hard for a non profit effort to compete.
However, that’s not why I use Lemmy. I don’t use it for building a mass movement, but for building community free of corporate interference. A place where we don’t have fascists debating the existence of trans people. This isn’t a town square, but a collection of punk clubs that kick Nazis out without needing to appeal to some landlord.
Also, in case you haven’t noticed, the Overton Window is being legally pushed to the right by the largest English speaking government in the world. There is no freedom of speech or dissent, and corporate media will fully cooperate with the government in their efforts to ban any left wing organizing. There is no marketplace of ideas to debate in on those platforms, as even when there wasn’t open fascism like now, the right were always given more leeway to be radical. Pre musk Twitter protected fascist accounts like Libs of Tik talk, while those accounts now run both the government and the companies.
At least here we can always rebuild if instances get censored. At least here we can be more than censored opposition.
Epstein files also seem to be the first thing that cracked his base of political support.
We all need to get a lot better about actually visiting and reading right-wing websites and groups. Even if they are painfully stupid and infuriating, we have to know the reality of what they think and feel.
This is because for every huge story that breaks, the media splits it into two angles. One set of headlines pandering to the right, and another pandering to the left.
Because of this, Epstein had a far smaller long-term impact on the right than we think. They have already moved on, every bit of “outrage” was performative and lip-service to the few right-wingers who want to feel intellectually honest. (Very few of them.)
They are celebrating in the streets right now, they feel they are winning and they don’t actually care about child sex trafficking, largely most of them attached to that cause because it feels objectively good and they all want to be the “good guys.” That storyline is over, they’ve moved on to new storylines.
I’ve seen a lot of houses in my city that I noted as having Trump flags have taken them down this summer. My Republican family members, and those of my friends, certainly aren’t sharing that sense of victory you’re claiming to see. They remember that Trump promised to release the files and haven’t. They’re all riled up ready to prosecute Bill Clinton and wondering why Trump has gone soft.
And literally just last week the UK arrested 2 men for projecting a picture of Trump and Epstein together during his visit, which has brought a ton more attention to the story. It’s not going away just because you seem to want it to.
It’s not going away just because you seem to want it to.
I thought you had a good counterpoint up until you tried to be smug edgy dude. Fuck off, understand what’s at stake and why people like myself are worried that the left is going to get stuck spinning it’s wheels in a procedural issue while we’re literally losing the constitution. You can care about Epstein and keep pushing on it, I don’t give a fuck, just stop calling everything else major that happens a “distraction” like it doesn’t matter.
I didn’t call anything a distraction, and I doubt you throwing out insults or telling me to “fuck off” is going to change anyone’s mind but okay. Your own comments are full of smug jokes that I chuckled without needing to personally attack you over.
I agree with you that the Epstein case is relatively small compared to the millions of people who Trump is causing to suffer. However, the Epstein files also seem to be the first thing that cracked his base of political support. It is a weakness that anyone against Trump should exploit, not because it’s the most important issue, but because it’s the one that is most likely to remove him from power.
Deporting immigrants, locking up trans people, outlawing abortion, destroying free speech and political opposition, supporting genocide… These are all things that his base WANTS. They rejoice in the suffering of the “other”. They care about the economy too, but they’re told dumb to realize that Trump is the problem.
That’s all well and good, but like I said, keep it the fuck out of serious conversation, especially on here. There aren’t gonna be many Trumpers on this platform, as leftists and queer people are such a major population that they’d struggle to tolerate it. At most there are very mild conservatives who are usually not beyond reaching with actual arguments. I would get this argument more if we were on a corpo platform, but on this one you’re just distracting from issues we actually care about.
edit: spelling
You’re making a lot of broad assumptions about audiences. And “serious conversation”… My sibling in Satan this is c/politicalmemes.
These memes don’t just stay on Lemmy either. They get reposted all across the internet, printed on stickers and posters and t-shirts. The UK just jailed journalists last week for the terrible crime of projecting a picture of Trump and Epstein together on a building during Trump’s visit. It’s very much a topical issue that is heavily tied to broader issues of free speech and political corruption. And it’s not just about Trump- how many other powerful people are in those files that faced no consequences? This isn’t distracting from other issues- it’s a part of them. All of these other issues seem to always track back to billionaires promoting horrible inhuman behavior and fascism, so I don’t see how the Epstein files are distracting from anything.
I’m also critical of Biden and Garland for not doing more with this when they were in power. This isn’t
It doesn’t just happen here genius. I’ve seen such reaction images on news stories about the administration looking to label antifa as terrorists. This is a seriously scary move that will be used to silence any dissent, but apparently it’s all a fucking distraction from well established pedophilia by a man above the law.
I really I shouldn’t be surprised by the reaction here. If we’re talking about audience, I know a lot of people here are the ones who need to see this meme.
It doesn’t really matter where it is
The thing I hate most about Lemmy is what a fucking circlejerk it is.
I know people are gonna read this and make deeply frowny faces and try to poke me with their little arrows but we have to get better about identifying what a fucking bubble we all fall into.
These kinds of sites are the same as what the right uses, but the left gets far less out of them for affecting change and good outcomes. They’re feed-troughs to get people gathered together, getting their feelings out of their system, without actually going out and challenging power and facing the opposition. It’s like when you have a great idea for a novel and you tell your bored friends all about it and that gets the inspiration out of your system so you never pursue it.
It is true that Lemmy sucks for having substantial reach. If I wanted to reach the largest possible audience for advocacy’s sake, I would use corpo socials. They optimize for the largest reach because that’s where they make money, so it’s hard for a non profit effort to compete.
However, that’s not why I use Lemmy. I don’t use it for building a mass movement, but for building community free of corporate interference. A place where we don’t have fascists debating the existence of trans people. This isn’t a town square, but a collection of punk clubs that kick Nazis out without needing to appeal to some landlord.
Also, in case you haven’t noticed, the Overton Window is being legally pushed to the right by the largest English speaking government in the world. There is no freedom of speech or dissent, and corporate media will fully cooperate with the government in their efforts to ban any left wing organizing. There is no marketplace of ideas to debate in on those platforms, as even when there wasn’t open fascism like now, the right were always given more leeway to be radical. Pre musk Twitter protected fascist accounts like Libs of Tik talk, while those accounts now run both the government and the companies.
At least here we can always rebuild if instances get censored. At least here we can be more than censored opposition.
We all need to get a lot better about actually visiting and reading right-wing websites and groups. Even if they are painfully stupid and infuriating, we have to know the reality of what they think and feel.
This is because for every huge story that breaks, the media splits it into two angles. One set of headlines pandering to the right, and another pandering to the left.
Because of this, Epstein had a far smaller long-term impact on the right than we think. They have already moved on, every bit of “outrage” was performative and lip-service to the few right-wingers who want to feel intellectually honest. (Very few of them.)
They are celebrating in the streets right now, they feel they are winning and they don’t actually care about child sex trafficking, largely most of them attached to that cause because it feels objectively good and they all want to be the “good guys.” That storyline is over, they’ve moved on to new storylines.
Have you actually talked to any of them?
I’ve seen a lot of houses in my city that I noted as having Trump flags have taken them down this summer. My Republican family members, and those of my friends, certainly aren’t sharing that sense of victory you’re claiming to see. They remember that Trump promised to release the files and haven’t. They’re all riled up ready to prosecute Bill Clinton and wondering why Trump has gone soft.
And literally just last week the UK arrested 2 men for projecting a picture of Trump and Epstein together during his visit, which has brought a ton more attention to the story. It’s not going away just because you seem to want it to.
I thought you had a good counterpoint up until you tried to be smug edgy dude. Fuck off, understand what’s at stake and why people like myself are worried that the left is going to get stuck spinning it’s wheels in a procedural issue while we’re literally losing the constitution. You can care about Epstein and keep pushing on it, I don’t give a fuck, just stop calling everything else major that happens a “distraction” like it doesn’t matter.
I didn’t call anything a distraction, and I doubt you throwing out insults or telling me to “fuck off” is going to change anyone’s mind but okay. Your own comments are full of smug jokes that I chuckled without needing to personally attack you over.