• Evilsandwichman [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Absolute barbarity; not enough to murder your enemies, but to do everything to murder their families too

    ‘it was an accident’, Trump literally showed a Taliban leader a picture of his house and threatened to murder his family; none of this is an accident

    • 3rdWorldCommieCat [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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      6 days ago

      Comrade I am sorry about how many white users you will have on your ass over this damn near universal cry from the middle east about how this makes white people feel upset on a thread about a murdered little girl. But you are 100% right.

      • Le_Wokisme [they/them, undecided]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        we have Classic Nazis in my country and they are supporting Classic Nazis in Ukraine. Canada literally gave a standing ovation to an actual original nazi. Tucker Carlson draws breath. Elon musk did that on tv, twice.

        conflating israel with all jews plays into the hands of the zionists. I don’t give a fuck about white liberal feelings, i care about the tactical error and the swastika seig heil nazis that are still around.

      • hello_hello [undecided, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        I was in the middle of the isntrael scandal (I made the catalyst emoji request for it) and the amount of liberal zionism that had to be beaten out of this site was absurd.

        An Arab child can have their body riddled with bullet holes and crushed under concrete but when the parent says “death to Jews” that becomes the problem instead.

        A Palestinian man can take a picture of a starving dog and have the whole world shed tears for the dog and not for the man whose family is also sick and starving, in a shelter not even fit for a dog.

        • 3rdWorldCommieCat [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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          6 days ago

          “Al Sarkha” or “the collective outcry” from Ansar Allah was modeled after revolutionary Iran and adopted in 2003, right after POTUS Bush Junior’s invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan as well as the Palestinian second intifada. The line “Curse upon the the Jews” has drawn ire from international audiences for being antisemitic.

          It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system as Christianity has been. Jews are not a race nor are they an ethnicity and to say so is to directly support Israel’s myth of existence which is predicated on the revisionist history of Judaism as well as the centrality of the European Jewish experience above all others.

          To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

          Incredible how we are on a thread detailing the murder of an innocent baby girl with her grandfather and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt.

          • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            When Jewish supremacists are doing a Jewish supremacist apartheid with the goal of creating a Jewish ethnostate that dehumanizes, displaces, and destroys countless Indigenous cultures with the ultimate aim of genocide, then somehow the victims of that colonial monstrosity are expressing bigotry by cursing their Jewish oppressors.

            As if the history of European anti-Semitism is now the sin of the Ummah, and they must atone for the crimes of white colonizers. Projection of guilt through and through.

            Complete lack of understanding racism as systemic, too. As though the oppressor is being reverse-oppressed through prejudiced language by the oppressed, a thing they will performatively claim to understand does not exist when people of colour insult white people. (Or queers curse straights, or women curse men, or the Irish curse Brits)

            • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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              6 days ago

              When the structures of power create hierarchies of livable lives and grievable deaths, those who exercise that power, who operate with the privilege of being seen fully as human, as subjects in history, can reify that power through oppressive language.

              When those who are deemed objects in history, dehumanized by the structures of power, use their language, it cannot by definition be oppressive, as they, by definition, do not have the power to oppress. These categories are not essential and immutable–the oppressor can become the oppressed, the oppressed can become the oppressor.

              But by no metric can anyone watching the current state of the world claim in good faith that the Jewish supremacist, genocidal ethnostate is by any means the victim of oppression. Outrageous.

              • purpleworm [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                6 days ago

                by no metric can anyone watching the current state of the world claim in good faith that the Jewish supremacist, genocidal ethnostate is by any means the victim of oppression. Outrageous.

                Yeah, that’s exactly what I said, that Israel is a victim. I’m really glad you’re trying to deal with this in good faith.

                • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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                  6 days ago

                  None of what i said was in reply to you, but sure, let’s talk about good faith. You presumably read through six paragraphs of my thoughts on how the oppressed cannot use language as a tool of oppression (more, actually, since you also read my replies to, again, someone who isn’t you, merely to ignore what i said and call me hostile and accuse me of playing the victim, a classic bigoted trope mind you), and the only thing you had to say about it was that you’re not calling the Zionist entity victims, not engaging at all with the content of my discussion. The content of my discussion, by the way, being that whether or not you personally consider the Zionist entity to be victims, by equating the language of the oppressed to the systemic racism of the white settler anti-Semites, you are, whether intentionally or not, equating the struggle of the oppressed to the struggle of the oppressor. You are misunderstanding what oppressive language is, and foisting the burden of the guilt of European anti-Semitism on people in an existential struggle against Jewish supremacists.

                  Language, like all social structures, is built on systems of power. Not all language is equal. Universalizing discourse is itself a colonial endeavour that silences the marginalized in favour of the narrative of the hegemony.

                  If you have real thoughts about this you could certainly express them, but defensively rejecting an accusation I never made toward you is very productive and good faith.

          • purpleworm [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression

            This is a crass generalization made to just to play with words to make excuses.

            Jews are not a race

            Obviously

            nor are they an ethnicity

            Ridiculous. They are a group of ethnicities, and while some ancestrally Jewish populations are so assimilated into other groups that they really aren’t a distinct ethnicity anymore, that’s not true universally even in America (where generally they are extremely assimilated).

            To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

            I’m not saying shit about them, let alone to them, I’m talking about this website.

            and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt.

            If you enjoy playing mind-reader, that’s fine, but don’t rope me into your fantasy roleplay.

          • purpleworm [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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            5 days ago

            This doesn’t contribute anything. It doesn’t present very much new information relative to other answers and is also irrelevant on the basis that I said nothing about condemning (for example) the Houthis and indeed support their actions in fighting Israel. I have not directed criticism at them (even though we shouldn’t be using a moralizing reasoning of giving people a status above being criticized), my complaint was solely about having this banner as an emoji. There are other Houthi (etc.) symbols that we can use if that’s your interest, and if it isn’t then why even bring this up?

    • Arahnya [he/him, fae/faer]@hexbear.net
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      6 days ago

      im disappointed so many people here dont know the full collective outcry when they say “death to america.” It was one of the first things I learned about when I began reading theory. How may people are saying death to america without knowing the full context, or picking and choosing when to show outrage over a line that makes them uncomfortable? Without listening to the voices of the collective outcry?

      • Arahnya [he/him, fae/faer]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        hexbear slogan : Death To America

        anyway I recommend Mark Mazower’s book on antisemitism : a word in history

        alt text: could antisemitism perhaps even become one of those terms that – as he wrote – remain “like a fossil” to testify the preoccupations of the bygone era? All we can say is that contention is over.

        mark mazower

        on antisemitism : a word in history

      • 3rdWorldCommieCat [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        “Al Sarkha” or “the collective outcry” from Ansar Allah was modeled after revolutionary Iran and adopted in 2003, right after POTUS Bush Junior’s invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan as well as the Palestinian second intifada. The line “Curse upon the the Jews” has drawn ire from international audiences for being antisemitic.

        It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system as Christianity has been. Jews are not a race nor are they an ethnicity and to say so is to directly support Israel’s myth of existence which is predicated on the revisionist history of Judaism as well as the centrality of the European Jewish experience above all others.

        To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

        Incredible how we are on a thread detailing the murder of an innocent baby girl with her grandfather and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt.

        • cornishon@lemmygrad.ml
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          6 days ago

          To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

          Enough said.

          • 3rdWorldCommieCat [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            The cry universally used by the resistance is that to you now lmao gotta phone Ansar Allah real quick. Like hello_hello previously said:

            "“Al Sarkha” or “the collective outcry” from Ansar Allah was modeled after revolutionary Iran and adopted in 2003, right after POTUS Bush Junior’s invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan as well as the Palestinian second intifada. The line “Curse upon the the Jews” has drawn ire from international audiences for being antisemitic.

            It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system as Christianity has been. Jews are not a race nor are they an ethnicity and to say so is to directly support Israel’s myth of existence which is predicated on the revisionist history of Judaism as well as the centrality of the European Jewish experience above all others.

            To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

            Incredible how we are on a thread detailing the murder of an innocent baby girl with her grandfather and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt."

            Wtf is wrong with you that you’d rather police the language of genocide victims and survivors over nearly 200 little girls murdered in a day?

            • Johnny_Arson [they/them]@hexbear.net
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              6 days ago

              To do politeness finger wagging

              Fuck off that isn’t what I or anyone else is doing. Jewish people did also suffer genocide, doesn’t excuse what Israel does but it also doesn’t excuse repeating “Curse on the Jews” I’m not even Jewish but it’s obviously not cool fuck off.

              • mathemachristian [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                6 days ago

                How do you feel about “A curse upon the christians” said by the people oppressed by christian supremacism, given the history of christian genocide in Turkey (Armenian, devshirme)?

                • Johnny_Arson [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                  2 days ago

                  I feel the same fucking way because it isn’t Jewish or Christian supremacism it’s white supremacism in all of these cases.

                  It’s not arab christians oppressing anyone it’s euros, same with Israelis, almost all of them are European, fucking Netanyahu was born in Philadelphia and calling it Jewish supremacism is just off putting to me because it is actually an offshoot of white supremacism and trying to deliniate the two especially when it’s fuckin white europeans doing it is only to absolve themselves to make it some unique thing. It’s still just cracker settler colonialism you don’t have to make it uniquely Jewish, that is Nazi shit.

                  Also your example of genocide in turkey like wtf are you talking about Turkey genocided Christian Armenians…

            • BeanisBrain [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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              6 days ago

              It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system as Christianity has been. Jews are not a race nor are they an ethnicity and to say so is to directly support Israel’s myth of existence which is predicated on the revisionist history of Judaism as well as the centrality of the European Jewish experience above all others.

              I hear this a lot on Hexbear, but would anybody on this site object to banning someone for posting e.g. Happy Merchant cartoons?

                • BeanisBrain [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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                  5 days ago

                  I wasn’t trying to equivocate the two. When I see stuff like Al Sarkha, I think of Norman Finkelstein talking about how his parents who were Holocaust survivors hated not just Nazis or German soldiers, but all Germans. Obviously, Happy Merchant is very different from that.

                  My point was that if we accept the specific premise that “antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system” then what separates those cartoons from emotes like anti-italian-action ?

          • hello_hello [undecided, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            What if it was actually meant to be read as “Death to Israel” -> “A curse upon the Jews” referring to how Israel is a curse on Jews everywhere who have been pulled into its orbit of settler colonialism just by existing?

            phoenix-smug edgeworth-pissed

        • Moss [they/them]@hexbear.net
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          6 days ago

          Incredible how we are on a thread detailing the murder of an innocent baby girl with her grandfather and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt.

          oh go fuck yourself im so serious

          • hello_hello [undecided, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            The slogan is from 2003 and is no longer primarily used today (instead being superseded by “America is the mother of all terrorism”), you had over 20 years to say “hey what the fuck” but specifically it had to be right now. The Sarkha was being posted during the ongoing genocide of Palestine after the Al Aqsa flood with the same translation.

            If I didn’t even provide a translation would you even have noticed? Maybe I should have censored the translation and said “Curse upon the Jews of Israel” and not have presented Yemeni victimization as it was back then.

            • Moss [they/them]@hexbear.net
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              6 days ago

              No, I wouldnt have noticed because don’t read Arabic, congrats, you got me, what point are you trying to prove? Pretending that anti-semitism doesn’t go hand-in-hand with fascism and colonialism is ridiculous.

              Do you seriously think I don’t care about the people America massacres because they’re muslim? Do I need to perform my disgust so everyone knows I think this is terrible? Fucking obviously I’m horrified. But “curse upon the Jews” isn’t anticolonial or anti-fascist, and its not an analysis any communist should ever agree with.

              • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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                6 days ago

                Pretending that anti-semitism doesn’t go hand-in-hand with fascism and colonialism is ridiculous

                But the Zionist entity is very specifically a fascist, colonial, and Jewish supremacist ethnostate. Is anti-Semitism truly the core of Jewish supremacy? Does it go hand-in-hand? Sure, we see quite often how fuelling anti-Semitism abroad is a tactic for inspiring support of the Zionist project in Occupied Palestine, but is it correct to say that the Jewish supremacist ethnostate is itself, within its own self-conception, anti-Semitic? And is that anti-Semitism a key feature and more important to analyze than the predominant ideological basis of its existence: fascist, colonial, Jewish supremacy?

                because from your sentence here, it seems like you are saying that by virtue of their purported anti-Semitism, the victims of the Zionist project are walking hand-in-hand with fascism and colonialism, rather being subjected to it at the hands of the very fascist and colonial Jewish supremacist ethnostate.

                I am stressing that the Zionist project is Jewish supremacist because it is a core component of the entity’s identity and ultimate goal, and a key piece of understanding why that sentiment exists in this outcry.

    • Oppopity@lemmy.ml
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      6 days ago

      Death to America

      Based.

      Death to Israel

      Based.

      Curse on the Jews

      Not based.

      2/3

      • hello_hello [undecided, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        “Al Sarkha” or “the collective outcry” from Ansar Allah was modeled after revolutionary Iran and adopted in 2003, right after POTUS Bush Junior’s invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan as well as the Palestinian second intifada. The line “Curse upon the the Jews” has drawn ire from international audiences for being antisemitic.

        It is not antisemitic because antisemitism no longer exists as a form of systemic oppression. Judaism has been subsumed by the white supremacist settler class system as Christianity has been. Jews are not a race nor are they an ethnicity and to say so is to directly support Israel’s myth of existence which is predicated on the revisionist history of Judaism as well as the centrality of the European Jewish experience above all others.

        To do politeness finger wagging to a people who have suffered genocide at the hands of Jewish settlers, US imperialists and gulf compradors is an insult to their intelligence and to their humanity.

        Incredible how we are on a thread detailing the murder of an innocent baby girl with her grandfather and all you can think about is how a Jewish person’s feelings might be hurt.

        • Johnny_Arson [they/them]@hexbear.net
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          6 days ago

          To do politeness finger wagging

          Those people are not the ones reading this and while it is understandable why that slogan manifested there is absolutely reason to say that part is not okay.

          Critiquing actually bigoted language is not “politeness finger wagging”

          • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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            6 days ago

            Have you considered that your position comes from one assuming that the people engaging in this rhetoric are European and not themselves victim of the Jewish supremacist project? That telling people online this language is not okay for them, but understandable for “those people” is a way of reinforcing that this space is not for “those people,” and instead it is a space for white Americans and Europeans? That you already assumed that “those people are not the ones reading this,” once again universalizing American experience and relegating the experience of people elsewhere as an exotic other that must not exist in your space?

            That if you, as a white American, feel uncomfortable using that language you could simply not use it yourself, knowing that for you it carries the burden of a history of anti-Jewish pogroms? A history that is not a burden for the Jewish supremacist apartheid state’s victims to carry and shoulder the guilt of?

            • Johnny_Arson [they/them]@hexbear.net
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              6 days ago

              How the fuck is it me siding with zionists by saying hey maybe we shouldn’t make an emoji out of a slogan with “Curse upon the jews”?

              Again what the fuck is wrong with you?

              • Muinteoir_Saoirse [she/her]@hexbear.net
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                How the fuck is it me siding with zionists

                Could you show me where I said that?

                Because I showed you quite clearly where your argument, the things you actually said, reinforce the understanding that this is a space for predominantly white American/European users, by the very assumption that “those people are not the ones reading this.”

                • Johnny_Arson [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                  6 days ago

                  those people are not the ones reading this.

                  I think you are misreading what I said. Zionists are not the ones reading this. If there are any here they get banned pretty fast. The only people that would be seeing for example the emoji another user requested, are not the people you are talking about. Why do you keep talking past my actual point?

  • RamrodBaguette [comrade/them, he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    As said, the “Gazafication” of the Global South is underway, despite the insistence of pro-Israelis and Zionists that Palestinians are “uniquely” expendable (though this “project” has been as old at least as the GWOT). Something like this they would have gone to greater lengths to cover up but now it’s treated with callous indifference. Even the garbage propaganda is the same (“it was a misfired missile”).

    Those who think the normalization of the mass slaughter and torment of Palestinians won’t condition how the West will treat them some time down the line are fools of the highest order. That includes dipshit exile communities in the imperial core but also people living outside the West in the periphery and beyond who think they can appease their way to a comfy place in a declining world order as the US Empire goes on the warpath.